Jump to content
Existing user? Sign In

Sign In



Sign Up

Disabled Bathrooms


Recommended Posts

This is possibly slightly off topic  

Has anyone else noticed what seems to be a trend for able-bodied people using lavatories intended for disabled people?

At work there are several able-bodied people who routinely use the disabled lavatories. It isn’t just when the usual toilets are closed for cleaning, or when they are fully occupied, but every time they go. 

Why do they do it? Just to avoid mixing with the hoi polloi In the standard mens’ bogs?

I find this slightly wrong, and would only do it if I had an urgent need and the other toilets were closed, and would still feel embarrassed about being seen using the disabled toilets  

What do others think about it?

Link to comment

I do it sometimes if there're no disabled people around who wish to use them. Mostly because of the size, regular restroom stalls are very tiny at many places, to the point you will be hitting side walls with your elbows and have nowhere to put your belongings on, while accessible stalls are always roomy and usually have some rails/hooks where you can put your jacket or bag on instead of holding it all in hands or laying it on the dirty floor.

It's a simple convenience, people use whatever most comfortable and well equipped restroom is available around.

Link to comment

Some possible explanations.

It seems almost routine in most Wetherspoons pubs (for those who actually like them...), where the rest of the toilets are usually located up at least two flights of stairs! Even though they’re meant to be locked by the special key, people generally make sure that they don’t shut the door behind them...

The size is probably a factor for some people. They’re just so much easier to move around in.

Availability is an obvious one. We have toilets in individual rooms off a single corridor at work, three marked as male and three marked as female. One of each is enormous and marked for disabled use (and has all the grab rails, alarms etc.). Some people prefer those to the smallest of the other two rooms. Personally I’d only use it if the other two were occupied (in preference to those marked for the opposite sex, although I’ve used those before too!). I don’t think we have anyone who’d *need* to use the disabled one though!

I’d hate to use a disabled toilet in any other context though, especially for anything more than a quick visit. The thought of having to leave to face a disabled person who’d had to wait for me to finish would be unbearable!

Link to comment

I have too often found that what distinguishes a "disabled" stall from a  normal stall is the presence of a sign, and it is not possible to fit a wheelchair into the stall. I have also found there is one stall out of several that is occupied:: the one disabled stall, occupied by a fully mobile person who was not carrying anything particularly bulky, nor were they caring for an infant/young child.  

 

Link to comment

I’ve never seen a single stall restroom called a “disabled” restroom before- is that a regional thing? I’m from California, and we refer to them as either single stall restrooms, gender neutral restrooms, or wheelchair accessible restrooms.

I also don’t know what you mean by seeing able-bodied people using them- how do you know? Disabilities aren’t always super obvious. Like my mother looks able bodied, but she uses single stall restrooms because she has trouble getting up after sitting down due to a hip disability. So she uses them, as the handles made for wheelchair users are perfect to help her up.

Also, single stall restrooms are almost always gender neutral (at least where I’m from). So someone who is not comfortable in a gendered restroom would feel comfortable using that one.

Honestly, I had no idea anyone thought it was strange enough to use them. They’re for everyone. Just more easily accessible for people with disabilities.

Link to comment

Many disabilities aren't easily visible, you can't tell if someone is disabled or not looking at them. Someone could have difficulty sitting and rising. They may need the extra space and privacy to deal with a medical device. This might also necessitate the availability of a toilet and sink in the same room. 

There's also the case that someone may have continence issues and only the disabled bathroom has a bin for continence products. 

They are also often the only gender neutral bathroom available. I have a friend who is transgender and he would feel distressed having to present as female and go into women's bathrooms but also doesn't appear obviously male enough to go in the men's without getting stared at or harrassed. I was with him once when he tried to enter the gender neutral disabled bathroom and a member of staff stopped him and said it was only for disabled people. I wish I had been brave enough to tell that person where to shove it. As a result this friend almost never uses the bathroom outside his own home as all of his options come with the risk of harassment.

I have another friend with bowell issues that can necessitate very urgent trips to the bathroom and she really values the extra privacy afforded in the disabled bathroom when available. 

Finally disabilities can fluctuate. Someone might have fatigue that often means they use a wheelchair but maybe on this day they were able to leave it at home. However they may feel safer having handrails to hold as they sat and stood up in case they fell over. This person may certainly look young and appear fully able bodied. I suppose that's kind of the same point as the invisible disabilities one but my point is that people's needs change and they shouldn't have to justify this repeatedly. 

The concern over apparently able bodied people using disabled bathrooms obviously comes from a place of caring about the needs of people with disabilities. However the issue of lack of understanding and the questioning and embarrassment that results for people with less obvious requirements is a bigger issue. 

Link to comment
3 hours ago, Imouto Kitten said:

Perhaps the better question is:

Why are public buildings, after having one super deluxe stall, allowed to make all other stalls in multi-occupancy restrooms so crappy that no one would voluntarily use them if the super deluxe stall is available?

If a slightly higher seat makes it easier for some people to sit/stand without impeding others, why not make all the seats slightly higher?
If wheelchair accessibility is so important, why not require that all doors be wide enough for wheelchairs to pass through and all enclosed spaces intended for a human to enter large enough for a wheelchair to turn around?
Even if wheelchair accessibility isn't important, why allow stalls cramped enough that someone of average size can barely turn around and anyone above average has to solve a packing/sliding block puzzle just to use the facilities? And that's not even considering people with claustrophobia or who are carrying bulky items.
If falling is such a concern, why not have hand rails around the entire wall of the rest room? For that matter, considering the multiple water sources in a bathroom, why do we continue to use flooring that becomes slippery when wet?

An interesting point. In general I think maybe accessibility should be more of the standard rather than the exception. However I think the extra large bathrooms would still be required as some people need the space not just for a wheelchair but also for a carer, for moving from the wheelchair to the toilet and as I mentioned, the sink being in the same room and the extra privacy can be necessary for medical devices. If all bathrooms were quite this large then it would be very difficult to fit in enough to meet demand.

Perhaps most should be accessible but there should still be an 'extra accessible' bathroom available.

Link to comment
34 minutes ago, Ell19 said:

An interesting point. In general I think maybe accessibility should be more of the standard rather than the exception. However I think the extra large bathrooms would still be required as some people need the space not just for a wheelchair but also for a carer, for moving from the wheelchair to the toilet and as I mentioned, the sink being in the same room and the extra privacy can be necessary for medical devices. If all bathrooms were quite this large then it would be very difficult to fit in enough to meet demand.

Perhaps most should be accessible but there should still be an 'extra accessible' bathroom available.

I suspect like most things it comes down to cost. 

A larger cubical or bathroom occupies more square feet of building. The fittings cost money to buy and fit - those certified grab handles aren’t cheap. Usually the disabled toilet has a wash basin with it - more money to buy it, more expense in plumbing. 

So probably a lot cheaper just to fit a statuary minimum number of suitable accessible lavatories then give everyone else a minimum standard toilet. 

Link to comment
1 minute ago, WetDave said:

I suspect like most things it comes down to cost. 

A larger cubical or bathroom occupies more square feet of building. The fittings cost money to buy and fit - those certified grab handles aren’t cheap. Usually the disabled toilet has a wash basin with it - more money to buy it, more expense in plumbing. 

So probably a lot cheaper just to fit a statuary minimum number of suitable accessible lavatories then give everyone else a minimum standard toilet. 

Yeah, that's kind of what I intended to say. That there are things that could be done to make regular bathrooms more accessible than they typically are but that you would still need to have individual fully accessible bathrooms as we do now because you couldn't make them all that way.

Link to comment

My son is severely disabled and ideally I need a fully adult size bench and hoist as well as cleaning facilities, space for a carer and all his equipment so I have no choice but to use disabled toilets though the vast majority are still very unsuitable for his needs. In the uk I need something called a changing places bathroom but in the USA i’m Not even sure these exist yet? 

Link to comment
9 hours ago, Imouto Kitten said:

Perhaps the better question is:

Why are public buildings, after having one super deluxe stall, allowed to make all other stalls in multi-occupancy restrooms so crappy that no one would voluntarily use them if the super deluxe stall is available?

If a slightly higher seat makes it easier for some people to sit/stand without impeding others, why not make all the seats slightly higher?
If wheelchair accessibility is so important, why not require that all doors be wide enough for wheelchairs to pass through and all enclosed spaces intended for a human to enter large enough for a wheelchair to turn around?
Even if wheelchair accessibility isn't important, why allow stalls cramped enough that someone of average size can barely turn around and anyone above average has to solve a packing/sliding block puzzle just to use the facilities? And that's not even considering people with claustrophobia or who are carrying bulky items.
If falling is such a concern, why not have hand rails around the entire wall of the rest room? For that matter, considering the multiple water sources in a bathroom, why do we continue to use flooring that becomes slippery when wet?

Or to be more general:

Why do we think of the features usually found only in the super deluxe stall as accomodations for the disabled rather than basic conveniences of modern living? Actually, the frequency at which apparently able bodied people use the super deluxe stalls would suggest that either most people do think of them as basic conveniences of modern living or that less obvious disabilities are far more common than most people think. I'm hoping its the former, but fear it's the latter and suspect its a combination of the two.

And yes, if I was in charge of building codes, we might not end up with bathrooms filled with super deluxe stalls, but the requirements for standard stalls would make them at least deluxe by the old status quo.

At a bare minimum, I'd:

Bump up minimum stall size to 150 cm wide and 210 cm long if the door swings out and 300 cm long if the door swings in and a door width of 120cm. That's approximately 5, 7, 10, and 4 feet respectively for any of my fellow Americans who don't know SI.

Require a minimum coefficient of friction for a wet floor with all common sole materials(including common sock fabrics and bareskin since no one should be forced to wear shoes) and all common materials used for the part of a mobility aid that contacts the ground. I'd consult a scientist on what the minimum should be, the the goal will be to make wet floor signs obsolete. And as this is a safety issue and not just a comfort issue, older buildings will have fewer grandfather protections on this issue. Actually, might just extend this to a general requirement for a materiel to be sold as flooring.

All fixed, vertical surfaces must have protrusions suitable to support 250Kg(~550 pounds) and serve as navigational guides and meet a minimal coefficient of friction based on being wet and contact with all common glove materials and bareskin. Doesn't have to be traditional handrails and can be decorative in addition to functional, but must be functional. Again, as this is more about safety than comfort, older buildings will have fewer grandfather immunities.

Unless there is evidence that there are people harmed by the higher toilet seats, I'd probably just make the taller toilets that legal standard for toilets sold in the jurisdiction I'm making policy for.

Naturally, if it turns out any of the existing codes already go above and beyond the above, I wouldn't lower standards without a good reason.

For what it's worth, I've been legally disabled my whole life, having been born with glaucoma and going blind in my right eye before I could form memories. That said, after my parents sent me to a school for the blind in fourth grade and I learned how to be, as Uncle from Jackie Chan Adventures would say, handicapable, I never really felt disabled until going blind in my left eye at 25, and now, at 32, I'm back to feeling more capable than many people with no visual impairment. Hell, many of the people I live with have such poorly trained senses of touch and sound that I wonder how they can function even with usable vision(how does one live in the same house for years without knowing it well enough to navigate by touch and spacial memory alone? and that's not a skill I only picked up post blindness as I could navigate my home in the dark even when I could see!). That said, I have no qualms about using the super deluxe stall or the nice, single occupancy restroom on the main hall instead of the sardeen can multi-occupancy tucked in a nook in the corner and admitting I do so solely because its more comfortable, and that's even when I was at the Rehabilitation center for the blind where having poor to non-existant vision is the norm anad even some of the staff have vision problems.

thats awful what you had to go through. why did your eye doctor not prescribe eye drops for your glaucoma?? and if they did not work to reduce eye pressure do surgery on them to put in the drains to let the fluid out of the eye?? they could had at least saved your left eye knowing that you was born with to much eye pressure.  many people take the eye drops and it brings the pressure back down to normal levels and saves their vision from getting any worse once its been diagnosed. 

Link to comment
13 hours ago, Mbgpeelover said:

My son is severely disabled and ideally I need a fully adult size bench and hoist as well as cleaning facilities, space for a carer and all his equipment so I have no choice but to use disabled toilets though the vast majority are still very unsuitable for his needs. In the uk I need something called a changing places bathroom but in the USA i’m Not even sure these exist yet? 

I've noticed on my visits to the US they often just have one larger cubicle (often not even large enough to manoeuvre a wheelchair in) and that can be the only difference. 

What about everything else? They even have the same flush handles and locks on the doors so no good for people with reduced dexterity, arthritis etc. 

And no handles, benches, hoists.

I don't know how people are expected to manage and how anyone thinks a slightly larger cubicle is enough. 

They're also usually in the gendered bathrooms so not so good for people with carers of the opposite gender or who have other reasons for being more comfortable in a gender neutral environment. 

I don't know how old your son is but I'm sure as he got/gets older he would be unlikely to be happy going into women's toilets with you. 

Link to comment
25 minutes ago, Ell19 said:

I've noticed on my visits to the US they often just have one larger cubicle (often not even large enough to manoeuvre a wheelchair in) and that can be the only difference. 

What about everything else? They even have the same flush handles and locks on the doors so no good for people with reduced dexterity, arthritis etc. 

And no handles, benches, hoists.

I don't know how people are expected to manage and how anyone thinks a slightly larger cubicle is enough. 

They're also usually in the gendered bathrooms so not so good for people with carers of the opposite gender or who have other reasons for being more comfortable in a gender neutral environment. 

I don't know how old your son is but I'm sure as he got/gets older he would be unlikely to be happy going into women's toilets with you. 

He has zero understanding of the fact male and female toilets even exist but he’s almost my height! I am past caring what others think as far as seeing to his needs now but I really do wish there were better facilities for him and the thousands like him. 

Link to comment
5 hours ago, Imouto Kitten said:

@trackboy: I was less than 24-hours old when I was flown across state lines for a double Trabeculotomy(or a similar procedure) and underwent roughly a dozen-and-a-half eye surgeries dureing infancy(including two attempts to fix my detached right retina). My left eye was stable and my glaucoma deemed well managed without active treatment for most of my childhood and adolescence though I've spent much of my life on moisturizing eye drops for chronic dry eye. When my left eye first started giving me problems, my local eye doctor determined my glaucoma was acting up and put me on pressure drops. Six weeks later, I saw no improvement but the eye doctor told me to continue. After another month of no improvement, I sought a second opinion from halfway across the state and was scheduled for retina reattachment surgery when I came home from that appointment. Initial results where positive, but at six weeks post-op, my retina had detached again and I was scheduled for a second round. That didn't go as well and surgeons rarely make a third attempt as, even successful retinal reattachment tends to increase the amount of scarred retina. Last time I consulted an eye doctor, I was basically told I needed a significant advancement in either growing cloned retinas or buidling bionic retinas, both of which are hard problems since the retina is both extremely complex and extremely delicate(Making stem cells multiply and differentiate into a mass of rods and cones is easy, getting that mass to grow in the arrangement needed to form a functional retina is hard, and the waste heat inherent in electronics can easily damage the healthy optic nerve a bionic eye has to interface with).

@Ell19: Wish I had thought to mention this in my prior post, but there's a concept known as Universal Design, and it's been around for longer than I've been blind. Basically, the philosophy states that good design is accessible design where accessibility is integrated from the earliest planning rather than tacked on at the end, where accessible design makes life easier for everyone, not just those who need accessibility, where accessibility compliments or even enhances aesthetics instead of detracting from them. And, regarding the issue of cost, I suspect universal design can save money compared to tacking on accessibility as an afterthought.

That said, I'll agree that there will always be the extreme cases that are hard to predict or will require going above and beyond to accomodate, and some older buildings can't be upgraded in a cost-efficient manner. Still, I think there's a happpy medium to be struck between a single super deluxe stall and the bathroom equivalent of a cubicle farm and a whole bunch of super deluxe stalls that take up the majority of the building, and perhaps that happy medium is enough to make the standard stalls something the non-disabled and those with minor disabilities can be comfortable using and thus make the super deluxe stall more likely to be available when someone who truly needs features that can't be made standard comes along.

Though, tackling things from the opposite direction, I'm a bit appalled at how little wheelchairs and other aids for those with mobility impairments have improved in my lifetime. It's not my area of expertise, but given how much the technology that makes up everyday life has changed in my lifetime(The 3.5" 1.44MB floppy came out the year I was born with a data density of ~60 bytes per cubic millimeter, a 512GB microSD has a density of ~3.1GB per cubic millimeter, a >50 million fold increase), I refuse to believe a design that has remained essentially unchanged for decades and is notorious for being bulky, heavy, and cumbersome in tight spaces can't be improved on in either size, weight, portability, handling or comfort. I know smaller market makes it harder to take advantage of economies of scale, but that hasn't stopped assistive technology for the blind from improving at a similar pace to the mainstream, and there are even examples of things I generally think of as a feature for the blind and visually impaired hitting the mainstream(Look no further than Audible, the Amazon Echo, an devices compatible with Kindle eBooks that can perform text-to-speech on them).

@Nbgpeelover: I'm not entirely sure what you mean by "changing places", and I can only really comment on a tiny sliver of American public restrooms, but best I can tell, wall mounted, fold away changing tables are a common feature this side of the pond though there's little consistency with placement(some are in the common area of multi-occupancy restrooms, others are within the super deluxe stall), and I doubt many of them would be big enough to change all but the smallest kindergarteners, never mind caretakers changing teenagers or adults with continence issues.

It sounds like you are talking about standard baby change tables which only last on average until a child is about two. My son needs a full adult size changing bed with hoist like this. In the uk we have just over 1,500 of these in larger disabled toilets. We need so much more! 

46B7C0C4-3546-4071-AC9A-E4B29CEF3C90.jpeg

Link to comment
7 hours ago, Imouto Kitten said:

@trackboy: I was less than 24-hours old when I was flown across state lines for a double Trabeculotomy(or a similar procedure) and underwent roughly a dozen-and-a-half eye surgeries dureing infancy(including two attempts to fix my detached right retina). My left eye was stable and my glaucoma deemed well managed without active treatment for most of my childhood and adolescence though I've spent much of my life on moisturizing eye drops for chronic dry eye. When my left eye first started giving me problems, my local eye doctor determined my glaucoma was acting up and put me on pressure drops. Six weeks later, I saw no improvement but the eye doctor told me to continue. After another month of no improvement, I sought a second opinion from halfway across the state and was scheduled for retina reattachment surgery when I came home from that appointment. Initial results where positive, but at six weeks post-op, my retina had detached again and I was scheduled for a second round. That didn't go as well and surgeons rarely make a third attempt as, even successful retinal reattachment tends to increase the amount of scarred retina. Last time I consulted an eye doctor, I was basically told I needed a significant advancement in either growing cloned retinas or buidling bionic retinas, both of which are hard problems since the retina is both extremely complex and extremely delicate(Making stem cells multiply and differentiate into a mass of rods and cones is easy, getting that mass to grow in the arrangement needed to form a functional retina is hard, and the waste heat inherent in electronics can easily damage the healthy optic nerve a bionic eye has to interface with).

@Ell19: Wish I had thought to mention this in my prior post, but there's a concept known as Universal Design, and it's been around for longer than I've been blind. Basically, the philosophy states that good design is accessible design where accessibility is integrated from the earliest planning rather than tacked on at the end, where accessible design makes life easier for everyone, not just those who need accessibility, where accessibility compliments or even enhances aesthetics instead of detracting from them. And, regarding the issue of cost, I suspect universal design can save money compared to tacking on accessibility as an afterthought.

That said, I'll agree that there will always be the extreme cases that are hard to predict or will require going above and beyond to accomodate, and some older buildings can't be upgraded in a cost-efficient manner. Still, I think there's a happpy medium to be struck between a single super deluxe stall and the bathroom equivalent of a cubicle farm and a whole bunch of super deluxe stalls that take up the majority of the building, and perhaps that happy medium is enough to make the standard stalls something the non-disabled and those with minor disabilities can be comfortable using and thus make the super deluxe stall more likely to be available when someone who truly needs features that can't be made standard comes along.

Though, tackling things from the opposite direction, I'm a bit appalled at how little wheelchairs and other aids for those with mobility impairments have improved in my lifetime. It's not my area of expertise, but given how much the technology that makes up everyday life has changed in my lifetime(The 3.5" 1.44MB floppy came out the year I was born with a data density of ~60 bytes per cubic millimeter, a 512GB microSD has a density of ~3.1GB per cubic millimeter, a >50 million fold increase), I refuse to believe a design that has remained essentially unchanged for decades and is notorious for being bulky, heavy, and cumbersome in tight spaces can't be improved on in either size, weight, portability, handling or comfort. I know smaller market makes it harder to take advantage of economies of scale, but that hasn't stopped assistive technology for the blind from improving at a similar pace to the mainstream, and there are even examples of things I generally think of as a feature for the blind and visually impaired hitting the mainstream(Look no further than Audible, the Amazon Echo, an devices compatible with Kindle eBooks that can perform text-to-speech on them).

@Nbgpeelover: I'm not entirely sure what you mean by "changing places", and I can only really comment on a tiny sliver of American public restrooms, but best I can tell, wall mounted, fold away changing tables are a common feature this side of the pond though there's little consistency with placement(some are in the common area of multi-occupancy restrooms, others are within the super deluxe stall), and I doubt many of them would be big enough to change all but the smallest kindergarteners, never mind caretakers changing teenagers or adults with continence issues.

sounds like you had other eye  problems in addition to the glaucoma. in  glaucoma the excessive pressure inside the eye presses on the optical disk that is where the optic nerve comes into the eye ball. it starts cupping down into the optic nerve with the cup getting deeper. you start losing vision at the edges at first then the blindness moves in more and more to where you see a smaller         and smaller area. for most eye drops prevent its progression once it is diagnosed. you visit eye doctor regularly . one for a peripheral field test where you look inside a large ball while looking at a dot and lights of various brightness flash to map out how strong or weak your vision is in various areas. the other visit the pupil is dilated and the eye doctor looks inside your eye with a special light and lens to check the retina and optic nerve and blood vessels. 

Link to comment
17 hours ago, Imouto Kitten said:

Though, tackling things from the opposite direction, I'm a bit appalled at how little wheelchairs and other aids for those with mobility impairments have improved in my lifetime.

I think the aesthetics of mobility aids should be a bigger consideration too. In most cases they are completely functional with absolutely no consideration put into the way they look. I think it would be helpful to the mental health of those regularly using mobility aids to be able to make it look pleasing to them in the same way that the clothes we wear are important to us because they are part of the image we present to others. 

I have scarring that I almost always cover and originally I would use bandages (initially they were used as it was healing and for a while I kept using them to cover the scarring) but that never went with my outfit or blended in, it felt out of place. I soon started using different fabrics with a colour or pattern that went with what I was wearing and suited the occasion. I also got less questions that way as it stood out less. 

What I'm saying is it mattered to me that it didn't look like it had come out of a hospital and I'm sure that also matters to many other people. 

Link to comment

I'm transgender, and unfortunately in my area, true gender neutral restrooms are hard to find, and I'm not yet able to use the women's because I'm in the early stages of transition. I think there's probably 3 or 4 gender neutral places I can think of off hand, all of them being more so intended for handicapped people or families.

I often wind up using the men's, but I've also gone out of my way to use gender neutral ones too just to avoid the dysphoria.

Link to comment
21 hours ago, Jamiexpassion said:

I'm transgender, and unfortunately in my area, true gender neutral restrooms are hard to find, and I'm not yet able to use the women's because I'm in the early stages of transition. I think there's probably 3 or 4 gender neutral places I can think of off hand, all of them being more so intended for handicapped people or families.

I often wind up using the men's, but I've also gone out of my way to use gender neutral ones too just to avoid the dysphoria.

The only way society has to judge who belongs in what restroom is the way people look. If you can pass as female use the womens restroom, if you can pass as male use the mens room. 

Link to comment
3 hours ago, DeltaFoxtrot said:

The only way society has to judge who belongs in what restroom is the way people look. If you can pass as female use the womens restroom, if you can pass as male use the mens room. 

I usually use the men's because I'm not really presenting female much yet, and I almost certainly wouldn't pass yet either. Just far too early in my transition to use the women's.

Link to comment
6 hours ago, DeltaFoxtrot said:

The only way society has to judge who belongs in what restroom is the way people look. If you can pass as female use the womens restroom, if you can pass as male use the mens room. 

Um, no? Because the transgender person’s comfort level is whats important here, not what some rando’s arbitrary opinion is on if they pass or not. Especially when not every random person may agree. As well as the danger she would be put in if some bigot were in the bathroom and decided to assault her.

Link to comment

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...